0:00-2:02: Greetings! Jeff’s asthma is acting up!  Graeme has either forgotten or eschewed the word “example!” It’s another episode of your favorite comic podcast where the words “favorite” and “comic” are both suspect, and only “podcast” can be taken for granted. (Unless “podcast” implies some level of technical proficiency, in which case it’s *all* up for grabs!)
2:02-11:05: It seems to us like it’s been a million years since we’ve done one of these?  (It’s only been two weeks if you’re keeping track?)  Is that because Graeme has read so many Wonder Woman comics in the last week as a lead-up to the release of the new movie? It’s not clear, but it is a great excuse to talk about Wonder Woman comics, as Jeff asks Graeme to summarize his findings from reading that much Amazonian Princess in that short a time.  Much discussion of Greg Rucka’s recent revision of the Wonder Woman origin ensues.

11:05-18:58: And then since Graeme has also seen Wonder Woman, the movie (but Jeff has not), there is a spoiler-free discussion wherein Graeme talks about the movie and what he thought.
18:58-39:57: And here is where Jeff’s ulterior motive makes itself known—what is the worst superhero movie? Can we agree on one?  And if not, can we at least talk about how terrible Green Lantern is?  Because talking about Green Lantern is like talking about that time you got horribly stomach-sick at your cousin’s wedding: painful and embarrassing at the time (almost to the point of genuine humiliation), but kind of hilarious to reminisce about. (hashtag I’m sorry Cousin Burt.)
39:57-47:42: Awkward segue here in that if you start on this segment you catch Graeme at the tail end of his thought about those superhero movies that were clearly compromised by reshoots, and then goes on to talk about the curious situation of the Justice League movie, now that Zach and Deborah Snyder have stepped away from the film for very good personal reasons.  Is Justice League so messy that it will be in a way, critic proof? Will any good thing coming out of the movie now being credited to Joss Whedon?
47:42-1:00:16: And for a very different kind of DC superhero movie, Jeff recommends you check out Batman & Bill, a documentary available on Hulu about the crusade to get Bill Finger the recognition he deserves.  Even if you know the contours of the story, it’s a documentary that has some very satisfying twists and turns in it.  It’s well worth a watch, sez Jeff.  But how exactly does that lead into us discussing the comic book career of Gene Simmons?  Well, you’ll have to listen to find out, but we apologize nevertheless.  (Also, as someone who has edited over two hundred of these damned things, I don’t think we’ve ever done what we do starting just scant milliseconds before the 54:47 mark!)
1:00:16-1:13:19: “Graeme McMillan, I have to say this is a very odd installment of our podcast,” announces Jeff, who is not just whistling Dixie (which is an expression us olds use and I am only now thinking I should google and ensure the saying’s origins weren’t something egregiously racist).  (Still not sure!)
Anyway, that’s beside the point which I guess is: what the fuck is Marvel doing with their sale on digital trade paperbacks on Amazon?  (Apologies if that link isn’t active—it seems my Amazon links are a little sketchy when it comes to general sections, as opposed to specific products.) Discussed:  Seriously, what the fuck?
1:13:19-1:19:09:  “When you said we haven’t even talked about Marvel,” Graeme more or less replies fifteen minutes later, “I thought you were going to talk about the revival of Runaways.”  “Is that something you’re interested in, Graeme?” Jeff asks diplomatically.  Discussed: the revival of Runaways.
1:19:09-1:40:24: Jeff wants to talk about the comics he has read. First up: Deadpool: Bad Blood by Rob Liefeld, Chris Sims, Chad Bowers, and Romulo Fajaroo, Jr. with a very special musical interlude!  Also discussed: the first three issues of the current X-O Manowar run by Matt Kindt, Tomás Giorello, and Diego Rodriguez; the most recent few issues of Deathstroke by Priest, Hama, Pagulayan, Bennett, and others. Caution: includes SPOILERS for the wrap-up of the Lazarus Contract (in Teen Titans Annual #1, I want to say?).
1:40:24-1:44:29: Another book Jeff (re-) read recently and would like blab about for a spell:  Punisher: Born by Garth Ennis, Darick Robertson, Tom Palmer, and Paul Mounts.  Frank Castle’s final days in Vietnam?! What’s not to like about that?
1:44:29-1:48:59: Also read!  Spencer & Locke #1 by David Pepose, Jorge Santiago, Jr., and Jasen Smith! It’s Calvin & Hobbes meets Sin City!
1:48:59-1:52:10: The most recent issues of Moon Knight (#11-14) by Jeff Lemire, Greg Smallwood, and Jordie Bellaire!
1:52:10-1:55:55: 4 Kids Walk Into a Bank #4 by Matthew Rosenberg, Tyler Boss, and Clare Dezutti! Jeff liked it, but you kind of can’t tell through all the complaining!
1:55:55-2:00:28: Et cetera!  Including this.

2:00:28-2:05:39: Graeme does a terrible thing! A cross-examination about what Graeme is like in bars! And then…
2:05:39-end:  Closing comment!  Look for us on  Stitcher! Itunes! Twitter together and separately: Graeme and Jeff! MattTumblr,  and  on Patreon where a wonderful group of people make this all possible, including the kind crew at American Ninth Art Studios and Empress Audrey, Queen of the Galaxy, to whom we are especially grateful for their continuing support of this podcast.
In two weeks:  Baxter Building Ep. 30!  Covering Fantastic Four issues #271-277 by John Byrne.  Join us in 14!
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19 comments on “Wait, What? Ep. 226: Some other beginning’s end

  1. Jeff Lester Jun 4, 2017

    And for those with the need to cut and paste:

    http://theworkingdraft.com/media/podcasts2/WaitWhat226.mp3

    Enjoy!

  2. Spencer & Locke sounds a bit like Robert Loren Fleming & Keith Giffen’s March Hare – the story of a hitman and his invisible rabbit friend. It was “Scarface meets Harvey.”

    I’m betting Jeff has read it…?

    • Jeff Lester Jun 7, 2017

      I’ve seen that book innumerable times over the years but I have to confess I haven’t read it. As I recall, it came out shortly after the second Ambush Bug miniseries imploded and even though that was probably mostly John Byrne’s fault, I had such a bad taste in my mouth I deliberately avoided March Hare. May also have been around the time the Comics Journal pointed out the depths of Giffen’s ganking of Jose Munoz’s style…

      I think that’s right, unless I have it confused with that other indie book Giffen published? The one that’s not The Heckler?

      anyway, I haven’t read it. But I’m betting Graeme has?

  3. One thing I haven’t seen anyone mention about the Marvel Kindle sale: all the prose books they’ve been doing of late are ALSO on sale.

    They were a bit pricey before so I never checked ’em out but at $1.60 a pop, I’m grabbing a few just to see how this little foray is working out for them. (Plus, more Dan Abnett GotG, even in prose form, is never a bad thing)

    • Jeff Lester Jun 7, 2017

      That’s a great point, Zeb. I admit I totally saw the prose novels and really considered getting them at that price, but figured they’d mostly be camp throwaways for me. Kinda wish I’d noticed the Abnett GotG.

  4. andrew brown Jun 6, 2017

    thanks for the heads up on the amazon sale! i just picked up Epic Collections of New Mutants and Excalibur for about 7 bucks total

    • Jeff Lester Jun 7, 2017

      Glad we could help out! (Provided the whole sale doesn’t somehow cause the direct market to collapse or something.)

  5. BrianMc Jun 6, 2017

    I also grabbed a few books on Monday at the marvel Amazon sale. I regret that I bought only one volume of Uncanny X-Men Masterworks at a mere $3.40. I hesitated over buying much of the 10-volume run, and today the prices are up to $8.50 (half-off rather than 80%), and the whole deep discount seems to be over, or reduced to a 50% deal. Still a deal.

    When I tried to buy a UXM Masterworks vol from a page still up from yesterday, with a $3.40 price tag, it caused the page to reload at the higher price, with a note that reads:

    Important Message: Kindle book prices differ by country. The price for this Kindle book is different for your country and is displayed below. [Buy anyway yadda yadda] Have you moved recently? You may change your country [blah blah blah].

    So either that’s Amazon’s excuse for the unannounced sale’s unannounced ending, or the whole thing was actually a glitch and there’s a country somewhere in which you can still buy Marvel books for a couple bucks a pop.

    • Brendan Jun 10, 2017

      I am completely here for the discount conspiracy theories, and while this explanation is disappointing, it does sound reasonable.

  6. Mike Murdock Jun 6, 2017

    I laughed out loud for the musical interlude. You guys could have been talking about the weather for all it matters. That being said, I read New Mutants #98. Rob Liefeld can not write Deadpool as we know the character. I get why people could have found him interesting or even cool based on how he was originally written, but he wasn’t funny.

    Re: Not getting charged in a bar, I’ve seen places that do it for soda because soda comes from the little nozzle thing with all the sodas because they won’t have to ring that up. Orange juice is probably different.

  7. Bengt Jun 7, 2017

    The only Closing Time song I’d ever heard of before this was Leonard Cohen’s, which is, in my opinion, great.

    In Swedish bars they’ll typically charge you for everything, even tap water.

    • Jeff Lester Jun 8, 2017

      Hmm. Maybe there’s not as much of a need to incentivize designated driving?

  8. PersonofCon Jun 7, 2017

    I can vouch that the sale happened earlier this year too, in the second week of February. I can prove it with digital receipts of Coates’ Black Panther v1, Warlock Masterworks v1, Defenders Masterworks v1-3, Spider-Woman v1, Ms Marvel Masterworks v1 (which was a misclick), Dr Strange vs Dracula, Ultimates Omniversal v1, Might Avengers v1-23 Hellcat! v1, Doctor Strange: Strange Tales v1, Dr Strange and the Secret Defenders, and Marvel Holiday Special 2005, at which point my bank cut off my credit card suspecting fraud, which was probably for the best.

    • Jeff Lester Jun 7, 2017

      Nice list! That may not be the sale I was thinking of–I don’t have the receipts to match yours–but I’m glad you made out well.

      I almost wish the bank had cut off my credit card on this one. (If they really do pay attention to my purchasing history, there’s no way they could’ve doubted this was me.) Fortunately, the sale ended while I was still fiscally solvent.

      • Martin Gray Jun 8, 2017

        I’ve managed about two-thirds of Rucka’s WW but keep dropping off, it’s so very slow. I so disagree that Rucka’s reinterpretations make sense, it’s just another writer putting their stamp on the legend. The weirdness has been so dialled down that there’s very little actual WW there.

        • Jeff Lester Jun 8, 2017

          Interesting!! If that was your take, I suspect that would be mine as well.

        • Hmm…I’m not that far along (I’m reading it in trades and only have the two currently out so far) but I agree with you. I thought his initial run before Infinite Crisis was much stronger and willing to embrace the “weird” such as it were. Ferdinand, the Purple Ray etc… he managed to bring so much of what makes Diana unique in the DC canon into the book back then.

          The current stuff, for the most part, just feels like him trying to erase or retcon out the vast bulk of everything that has happened in the New52. Which is fine. Just not as appealing to me personally. Great art though! (esp Scott and Evely)

  9. David M Jun 11, 2017

    In my world ‘Closing Time’ is a moody instrumental by Tom Waits. I think I’ll stay there…
    Calvin and Hobbes meets Sin City? Isn’t that Tracer Bullet? Has anyone ever worked out the dates on the first Tracer Bullet strip and first appearance of Sin City? From my superficial search, they’re very close in time and it’s interesting to see Watterson and Miller pull out that high contrast graphic style at very nearly the same time. Is there anyone who knows about the lead times for these different comics who can cast further light on which was created first and whether this is one of comics weird coincidences or some sort of influence?

  10. Dan Coyle Jun 14, 2017

    Simmons Comics Group started at IDW and landed at Archaia eventually. The Galaxy Race comic did not come out. Graeme and Jeff forgot, however, about the other book Simmons probably wouldn’t want you to remember: Nick Simmons’ Skullduggery, later retitled Incarnate, which was a series about immortal warriors

    Skullduggery floated from IDW and eventually landed at Radical, retitled as Incarnate, written and penciled by Simmons with a studio of assistants. However, it soon became clear Simmons was swiping from many sources, most notably Tite Kubo’s Bleach (in fact, you can see Bleach tracing over the original art released for Skullduggery). Simmons eventually had to cop to the swiping and I don’t think the collection for Incarnate was ever released.

    Deadpool: Bad Blood was one of the comics I got in the Kindle sale, and Jeff, I think, was too kind to it. Sims and Bowers tried there best, but the plot for Bad Blood is infuritaingly flimsy and the artwork, while stronger than usual from Liefeld, can’t really make up for it. The plot is basically some childhood friend of Wade’s who idolized him somehow found out about Weapon X and went to them and demanded he make them “Just like Deadpool”. He’s not an army buddy, he’s not someone wade me later: he’s just some fat loser Wade knew in school. How did find out who Deadpool really was and know enough to get into Weapon X and… gah. Sometimes I wonder why Liefeld bothers, I really do.

    Wonder Woman I thought was great, and it was a validation of Zack Snyder’s approach to the DC heroes, and not the refutation of it some where hoping. Jenkins is just a much better director of actors and an overall stronger storyteller- she puts in some smart small moments like Ludendorff and Poison’s trick with the gas mask, or WW’s remaining comrades huddling together as the Germans bear down on them in the final battle. It’s the best Zack Snyder movie Snyder never made.

    And finally, I got a chuckle out of Graeme, of all people, pouting about a DCEU movie being given a “free pass”. I could say more, quite a bit more, about that statement, but I shouldn’t. But I’m laughing, oh I’m laughing.

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